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12:08 -!- Ingrid_ncc [~7d1@rosie-arch.ripe.net] has joined #plenary
12:09 < Ingrid_ncc> The presentation from Nat Morris, Esgob / Cumulus Networks has started
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12:09 < Ingrid_ncc> I will read out your questions at the end of the presentation tation
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12:29 < Ingrid_ncc> The presentaer has asked for questions
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12:35 < mickod-2110> legend nat
12:35 < mickod-2110> second time seeing that presentation
12:35 < mickod-2110> even better second time around
12:35 < Ingrid_ncc> Brett Carr, ICANN, has started his presentation "Name Collision Controlled Interruption".
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12:42 < lochii> what about .local?
12:42 < Habbie> what about it?
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12:42 < lochii> http://www.iana.org/assignments/special-use-domain-names/special-use-domain-names.xhtml <-- ah, it's in here
12:43 -!- shane [~smuxi@dhcp-29-155.ripemtg.ripe.net] has joined #plenary
12:43 < Ingrid_ncc> Hi Lochii, is your question answered or do you want me to ask Brett?
12:44 < lochii> its answered, thanks
12:44 < Ingrid_ncc> ok
12:44 < lochii> I just wondered why he didn't mention it, but it had actually been addressed last year
12:44 < Chaz6> ICANN should reserve some GTLD's for private use
12:45 < Habbie> Chaz6, domains are cheap
12:45 < Habbie> Chaz6, people should just get their own
12:45 < job> yes
12:45 -!- Chaz6-2 [~3ebe9473@rosie-arch.ripe.net] has joined #plenary
12:45 < Chaz6-2> ICANN could solve the name collision problem by reserving some GTLD's for private use, such as ".private"
12:45 < Habbie> no, it couldn't
12:45 < Habbie> one, it's too late for that
12:45 < Chaz6-2> ICANN have effectively obsoleted the dns NXDOMAIN response with this silly 172.0.53.53 scheme
12:45 < Habbie> two, single word private gTLDs have other problems than just name collissions
12:45 < Chaz6-2> and what about AAAA? This will only be useful for A queries
12:45 < Habbie> three, domains are cheap
12:46 < Habbie> the point of 127.0.53.53 is to make people notice
12:46 < Habbie> for that, v4 is sufficient
12:46 < Chaz6-2> No it is not too late
12:46 < Chaz6-2> This whole idea is crazy in my optinion
12:46 < Chaz6-2> WHich is easily solved by reserving a top level domain for private use
12:46 < Chaz6-2> Only people doing A queries will notice
12:46 < Chaz6-2> and it makes NXDOMAIN pointless
12:46 < shane> Don't we already have .LOCAL? 😛
12:46 < Habbie> shane, haha
12:46 < Chaz6-2> local is used by multicast services
12:47 < Habbie> local is reserved for mdns, yes
12:47 < Habbie> any other use is invalid
12:47 < Ingrid_ncc> Hi Chaz6-2, should I read out your question on AAAA?
12:48 < Chaz6-2> along the lines of rfc1918)
12:48 < Chaz6-2> damn it cleared the box as i was typing grr
12:48 < Chaz6-2> Ingrid: i will try to type my question
12:48 < Ingrid_ncc> ok i am watching 😉
12:48 < Chaz6-2> Ingrid: Please ask if they can reserver a TLD..
12:48 < Chaz6-2> Ingrid: for private use, similar to rfc1918
12:48 < Chaz6-2> such as ".private"
12:49 < Habbie> current slide mentions that you should get your own
12:49 < Chaz6-2> then there is no possibility of a name colission
12:49 < Habbie> (current slide is right)
12:49 < Chaz6-2> Domains are not forever, policies can change
12:49 < Ingrid_ncc> ok will do? what is your name and affiliation?
12:49 < Chaz6-2> It is Chris Hills and I work for National Grid
12:50 < Ingrid_ncc> ok, thanks Chris
12:50 < Chaz6-2> Thank you
12:50 < Ingrid_ncc> brett has asked for questions
12:51 < Chaz6-2> Ingrid: please also ask if this obsoletes the DNS NXDOMAIN response
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12:51 < Chaz6-2> Thanks Brett I will have a look
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12:52 < Ingrid_ncc> chris, ur question reg dns nxdomain is that answered?
12:52 < Chaz6> Habbie, was that covered in a slide?
12:52 < Chaz6> I might have missed it
12:52 < Habbie> Chaz6, i don't understand your DNS NXDOMAIN concern, so i cannot say if a slide covered it
12:52 < Habbie> Chaz6, did you understand that the 127.0.53.53 situation is temporary?
12:53 < Ingrid_ncc> should i ask brett?
12:53 < Chaz6> Habbie: currently if a domain does not exist, a dns server returns NXDOMAIN
12:53 < Chaz6> but now, it will return with a valid record
12:53 < Habbie> yes
12:53 < Chaz6> Is there a ny specificationa bout the TTL? This could cause dns cache filling attacks
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12:53 < chrisr> good q loch
12:54 < Habbie> Chaz6, i don't see how this could be used for attacks - not any more than any other wildcard anyway, and there are plenty of those in the DNS worldwide
12:54 < Chaz6> True
12:54 < keith_nm> I think it's unlikely there's been legacy internal-only use of IDNs
12:54 < Ingrid_ncc> let me know if u want me to read out ?
12:54 < Chaz6> Ingrid: thanks, I will make it clear if I want you to read out my question 🙂
12:54 < Ingrid_ncc> ok:)
12:54 < lochii> keith_nm: doesn't have to be legacy
12:54 < Chaz6> But I would expect to see a clear NXDOMAIN response for a domain that does not exist
12:55 < lochii> could be new use
12:55 < Habbie> Chaz6, and after the interruption period, that's what you'll get
12:55 < keith_nm> even that seems a bit unlikely to me
12:55 < Habbie> internal-only domains are wrong, IDN or not
12:55 < keith_nm> too bad ICANN didn;t agree to gathering data from this 🙁
12:55 < Habbie> so there SHOULD be no new use 😉
12:56 < Chaz6> Habbie: what about internal IP addresses, everyone could get public ip addresses
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12:56 < Habbie> Chaz6, plenty of v6 to go around
12:56 < Habbie> Chaz6, and private v4 space is well-specified
12:56 < Chaz6> Habbie: we should have the same available for domains
12:57 < Habbie> i disagree, and apparently ICANN also does
12:57 < Chaz6> But not the IETF
12:57 < Chaz6> ICANN likes making money
12:57 < Habbie> i don't know the IETF position on this
12:57 < chrisr> Habbie: agreed but it was best practise in m$ land for years (.local)
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12:58 < Habbie> chrisr, yes
12:58 < Habbie> chrisr, sadly
12:59 < chrisr> if you put it in a book, people will do it
12:59 < Habbie> yes
12:59 < Habbie> MS has reversed that position, of course
12:59 < Habbie> but yes, lots of MS networks still on .local
12:59 < keith_nm> info on .onion leakage at: https://indico.dns-oarc.net//contributionDisplay.py?contribId=17&sessionId=3&confId=20
13:00 < sjmurdoch> I'll be talking about Tor at 4pm, and that is one of the ongoing issues
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13:00 < chrisr> sjmurdoch, - looking forward to that
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13:01 < chrisr> habbie: we have 1 customer who's network is 6/8 because something like a SUN Microsystems book said "set an ip address like 6.x.x.x/8"
13:02 < Habbie> i've seen people give 10.0.0.0 to SUN 1
13:02 < Habbie> 20.0.0.0 to SUN 2
13:02 < Habbie> right now i have a customer who has all his servers internally in i think Iraq IP space
13:03 < jzp> we kept adding example space to reserved blocks, and vendors kept skirting using them :-\
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13:03 < jzp> cf cisco and 1.1.1.1 for wireless controllers
13:03 < Ingrid_ncc> the presentation and time for questions has ended.
13:03 < Chaz6> Thank you
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13:04 < Ingrid_ncc> Agustín Formoso, LACNIC, has started his presentation
13:04 < Ingrid_ncc> "Simon Project: Determining Latin America and Caribbean Internet Connectivity Through Latency Measurements"
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13:25 < Ingrid_ncc> Agustin has asked for questions
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13:28 < Ingrid_ncc> The session has ended
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13:29 < Ingrid_ncc> Job is making some service announcmenets
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13:29 < Ingrid_ncc> Session ended